The All’s Fair with Laura Wasser Podcast

Celebrity divorce attorney Laura Wasser has seen it all, and in her 20 plus years practicing Family Law in Hollywood the one thing she’s certain of is that all’s fair in love and war. Each week on the All’s Fair With Laura Wasser podcast, Laura and It’s Over Easy’s Chief Content Officer Johnnie Raines chat with celebrities, innovators and experts about relationships, breakups, love, war and everything in between.

Back to Blog


Surviving Narcissists and Thriving With Dr. Ramani Durvasula (@DoctorRamani) and Rebecca Zung (@rebeccazung)


Is the world being overtaken by Narcissists? It may seem that way especially when bullies have the microphone, but times, they are a-changin'! Today, we're joined by renowned experts on Narcissists, psychologist Dr. Ramani Durvasula (@doctorramani) and attorney Rebecca Zung (@rebeccazung). They share their professional opinions and advice on navigating relationships and negotiations with self-consumed, high-conflict personalities, who might be trying to bring you down. Laura has a realization, which comes as no surprise to Johnnie, and Dr. Ramani introduces everyone to a new tribe of empathetic people who base their existence on the virtues of kindness, respect, compassion and authenticity. Rebecca also shares an exclusive gift with our audience and provides the link to download it for'll have to listen to the show to get it!


Highlights discussed in this episode include:

  • The divorce rate (depending on how you look at it) seems to be going down in the USA, but the latest from Hollywood suggests just the opposite…
    • Published: 14.20 by Sara Casaus
    • Summary: An acerbic look at some of the celebrity marriages that have ended in divorce this year
  • Discuss the Smart Mommy Article:
      • Title: I’m Divorced, but I’m Keeping My Wedding Dress
      • Published: 18.20
      • Author: Katie Bingham-Smith
      • Summary: The warm memories one woman has involving the lead-up to and the purchase of her wedding dress have not soured, even years later following her divorce.


  • What is a Narcissist?
    • Merriam Webster’s 2020 definition = an individual showing symptoms of or suffering from narcissism: such as
      1. An extremely self-centered person who has an exaggerated sense of self-importance
      2. A person who is overly concerned with their appearance
    • What is Narcissistic Personality Disorder?
      • From The American Psychiatry Association:
        • A pervasive pattern of grandiosity (in fantasy or behavior), need for admiration, and lack of empathy, beginning by early adulthood and present in a variety of contexts, as indicated by five (or more) of the following:
          1. Has a grandiose sense of self-importance (e.g., exaggerates achievements and talents, expects to be recognized as superior without commensurate achievements).
          2. Is preoccupied with fantasies of unlimited success, power, brilliance, beauty, or ideal love.
          3. Believes that he or she is “special” and unique and can only be understood by, or should associate with, other special or high-status people (or institutions).
          4. Requires excessive admiration.
          5. Has a sense of entitlement, i.e., unreasonable expectations of especially favorable treatment
          6. Is interpersonally exploitative, i.e., takes advantage of others to achieve his or her own ends.
          7. Lacks empathy: is unwilling to recognize or identify with the feelings and needs of others.
  • Questions for Dr. Ramani:
    • What are the realistic expectations during the divorce process that are essential when divorcing a narcissist?
    • Why do you advise not using the "narcissism" word when talking about your divorce process in courtrooms and with friends and family - why is this word so tricky?
    • Why is therapy so important when someone is going through the divorce process with a narcissist?
    • How does one educate those around them so the “get it” when it comes to narcissism?
  • Info about her book “Should I Stay or Should I Go?” (From her talking points about her book “Should I Stay or Should I Go?”):
    • Synopsis: Should I Stay or Should I Go is a survival manual, a guidebook, and a shot of reality.  Some people will never change, and kissing frogs is the stuff of fairy tales, not real life.  The Beast never turns out to be a nice guy (or gal).  This is a book that breaks down what mean people do to us, how they do it, and what we can do to survive.  
  • “Should I Stay or Should I Go?” (about her book of the same title)
    • Do you feel like you are talking and your partner never listens?
    • Do you keep saying the same thing over and over again?
    • Does your partner break or betray your trust repeatedly?
    • Have you read every relationship book out there, practiced your communication skills and still feel unheard or neglected?
    • Are you done with second chances?
  • Hoovering & Catching A Narcissist in a Lie (from her Instagram Feed)
    • Play and discuss her most recent IG posts (@RebeccaZung):
    • Questions for Rebecca about negotiating with a narcissist (from her talking points)
      • Discuss the meaning of the Q & A below:
        • Q: Why did the narcissist cross the road?
        • A: Because they thought it was a boundary…
      • How did you (Rebecca) come to focus on narcissists and negotiating with them
      • In negotiations, what motivates someone who might have narcissistic personality disorder?
      • Share some of your experiences working with clients navigating a divorce?
      • How can you get someone with these tendencies to negotiate successfully? 
      • Free gift for our listeners?  (Free Crush My Negotiation Worksheet)